The Bottom-Up Revolution Is…Rallying a Community To Fight Highway Expansion
Stanis Moody Roberts is a business owner from the Portland, Maine area. For the past year he has been organizing locals to oppose a highway expansion that would have claimed eight acres of his land. He joins Tiffany on today’s episode of The Bottom-Up Revolution to discuss this journey and the progress his community has made — including how they convinced their town council to rescind support for the project and delayed construction by several years.
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Tiffany Owens Reed 0:06
Hi everybody. Welcome to another episode of the bottom up Revolution podcast. I'm your host, Tiffany Owens, read I am excited to bring you another conversation here on the show, one of our core campaigns at strong towns is to challenge the status quo when it comes to highways, how and how we handle congestion, how we handle traffic, and the constant assumption that the only way to solve these problems is to make highways wider and bigger. So it's always really fun when I get to bring on, when I get to bring someone on the show who is active and the the freeway fighting space. We've we've had one conversation, I think, like this so far, with our friends down in Austin who are fighting an expansion down there. Stop i 35 and today I'm bringing you another conversation from a different part of the country. But you know, just as worthy of an effort, even though perhaps fighting highways and Texas Highway expansions in Texas and fighting highway expansions in Maine might feel a little bit different. It's all for good cause, and I'm just excited to bring you this story. Staunis moody Roberts is a business owner from the Portland Maine area. For the past year, he has been organizing locals to oppose a highway expansion that would have claimed eight acres of his land, and obviously, you know, brought many consequences to many other people and businesses in the area, which we'll tell you about. He's joining us today to share with us about this journey, about this effort, and the progress that they've made. Sones, welcome to the bottom of Revolution Podcast. I'm really excited to have you here. Thank
Stanis Moody Roberts 1:42
you so much, Tiffany. I am so excited to be on this podcast, having listened to a few of them already, and I really appreciate you giving us this opportunity to share our story and to highlight where we are in this fight.
Tiffany Owens Reed 2:01
Yeah, well, this show is all about talking to ordinary people who are taking those important incremental steps to improve their communities, and yeah, and fight these fights. So it's always, honestly, it's always an honor when I get to talk to someone who's doing this, because I always feel so much admiration for people who are who are tackling these bigger, these bigger issues, and seems to me a little bit like a David and Goliath story. But let's jump into your story. There's a lot to unpack. Highway expansions can be a little bit technical. There's a lot of details to explain, but listeners, hopefully we've organized this story so that you don't feel too, too bogged down by details, but and just caught up in the drama. So staunis, let's start. You know, every story has its set of characters. Let's start by talking about one of the key characters in this story, the main Turnpike Authority, Maine, as in the state. So we're, I'm going to ask you a few questions, and I know this first one might be a little bit, might require a little bit of a longer answer. But first of all, just tell us. What is the Turnpike Authority can? Can you just tell us what it is, and can you give us a brief history of their existence?
Stanis Moody Roberts 3:17
Yes. So the main Turnpike Authority is separate from the state of Maine government separate from the main Department of Transportation. It is considered a quasi governmental organization, and the authority was created in 1941 in order to construct a limited access toll highway from Maine southern border with New Hampshire all the way, at that time, to Canada on the northern border. And the first section 109 miles from Kittery to Augusta, which is our state capital, was completed for around 75 million before the Federal Highway Act in 1956 was passed, which then resulted in the rest of the highway from Augusta to the Canadian border, being built as a freeway with federal funds. Initially, the Turnpike Authority was supposed to disband and turn the turnpike over to the state once the original construction bonds were paid off. That occurred in 1981 however, by that time, the authority had become a pretty powerful organization, and managed to convince the legislature then to authorize its continuance, and has been in existence since then, charging tolls on the on that section of turnpike and having no real go on its operation other than maintaining the highway and looking for. Ways to continue the need for it to exist.
Tiffany Owens Reed 5:04
All right, that was an excellent overview. Okay, I'm going to ask you another question. So now we know a little bit about their history. We know a little bit about a little bit about the nature of their existence. Tell us a little bit about this whole expansion drama, what? What role have they played in this in this story, this effort to expand the highway. We will talk a little bit more about the exact nature of the expansion later, but just kind of situate the character a little bit like what, what have they been the main ones driving this expansion? What's important for readers to know here?
Stanis Moody Roberts 5:41
Yes, so the first thing to know is that the Turnpike Authority is a pretty powerful bureaucratic organization. They earn massive amounts of revenue from the tolls that are charged from the New Hampshire border up to Augusta. And there they've got the power of eminent domain. They have little governmental oversight, as they're independent from the state government, and they the history they're known for providing cushy jobs, political appointments, extravagant spending on food and travel and lobbying and back in 2011 their long standing executive director was jailed for repeatedly embezzling funds. So the role in this drama began in 1988 with a proposal to connect the turnpike mainline to Gorham, which is a suburb five miles to the west of Portland, with a new turnpike spur as part of this wider vision of a possible new turnpike that would extend west from Portland to the western part of the state. And in 1988 that proposal was quickly shot down by the public. There was a lot of outcry that it was overkill, that it was misuse of funds and that it was environmentally and culturally destructive. So that ended quickly, but starting in 2001 the Turnpike Authority began plotting the expansion once again.
Tiffany Owens Reed 7:18
Now, just to clarify, when they propose expansions, they're not paying for them, right? They have all this money from the term, but they don't take that money and put it back into the highway. These expansions are funded through bonds. Correct?
Stanis Moody Roberts 7:29
Exactly they would, for this particular one, would be funding it through through bonds, although, as the prices escalated. They've the most recent proposal was to put 150 million of their reserves into the project in order to try to cut down the cost, to make it more realistic. But publicly, they try to say that everything is going to be self funding. Okay,
Tiffany Owens Reed 8:00
all right, so we've talked off, offline, away from this recording, and you've walked me through this expansion. So let me tell you what I know based on our conversation, and then I'll ask you to fill in the gaps for the readers. So what I know is that this would be a five mile, four lane toll road stretching from South Portland to Gorham, as you mentioned, which are two towns in Maine, and it would cost about $331 million right? So sonus, you take it from there. What would you add? What would you clarify? Yeah, so
Stanis Moody Roberts 8:32
there's a lengthy backstory that you can get into later, but you're right with the current proposal. It goes from this major commercial area in South Portland, that's part of the Portland commercial Employment Center, which is the largest here in Maine, and headed out west to Gorham, which is traditionally a more rural small town place has a charming village center, and it's increasingly been developing into more of a suburb, bedroom community that has a large population that commutes into Portland for work, the path would be five miles, like you said, through mostly undeveloped wetland, which is the remaining area in here that that hasn't been developed through farmland and a golf course, but it would still be taking around a dozen houses, including My next door neighbors, and there would be two additional interchanges along the way, along the path. And the initial estimated price in 2017 when it first got legislative approval, was 150 million. And the latest one, like you said, in 2002 Three was 330, 1 million. And we have a feeling that that's probably a low estimate. I
Tiffany Owens Reed 10:07
would bet money that you're right. I've heard it said these numbers that you're given, just consider them starting points, starting prices
Stanis Moody Roberts 10:16
Exactly. I think it's all about what can still be palatable to the public, and they're slowly
Tiffany Owens Reed 10:25
what was, what was the story here? Like, what, what is the main Turnpike Authority telling people about why, why this expansion is needed? What? What was the context behind this push for expansion? It's
Stanis Moody Roberts 10:39
commuter traffic to the west of Portland, between Gorham and the surrounding towns and into Portland that occurs. There's a backup that occurs at rush hour because of that commuting traffic, particularly along this one single bottleneck where two of the major local roads combine for a short section, so you have two regular, you know, two lane busy roads that then combine for a two lane section, and that causes a bottleneck on either end. But traffic on these area roads actually peaked around 2005 and back then, that was when the turnpike first started sort of plotting this expansion. There was this perception that the traffic would be getting exponentially worse, and their traffic projections then were assuming like a two and a half percent increase every single year. And then we had the 2008 recession. We've had the COVID pandemic, and particularly here in Maine, we have a aging demographic with a declining working age population. So taking that all together, and also the fact that there are more job opportunities outside of Portland, it's actually meant that there's less commuter traffic between Gorham and Portland now than there was back in 2005 about 10% less, and while there are still backups occurring during that rush hour, the idea of This drastic solution of the neutral highway is really quite dubious, especially as there are so many other intersection improvements that can be done. Yeah,
Tiffany Owens Reed 12:30
let's talk about alternatives. So let's introduce another character briefly here the local MPO, that's a metropolitan planning organization, pretty sure that stands for they suggested a different solution. Can you tell us about what their alternative proposal was and why? Like, what happened to that? Yeah,
Stanis Moody Roberts 12:47
so this area, to give a little bit of context, it's probably one of the worst places in Maine for traffic, but compared to other places in this country that would the traffic isn't is quite minor. It's about, at the worst, it's about a 10 minute delay for about an hour in the morning, about an hour in the evening. So the our MPO Portland area, comprehensive transportation committee acts has been looking to improve the congestion here for quite a while, and back in 2003 they had a two step process that they had proposed, which was to first make various intersection improvements and spot widen in places and see how that would work. And then, if needed, instead of widening the whole road, which they were worried would change, you know, the character of the area, they had a localized bypass, which was just a regular additional road for about one mile that would bypass the overlap section where those two major roads had combined and created that bottleneck, and that point where they were all ready to move forward with that plan in 2003 was when the Turnpike Authority came back and said, Start lobbying for a turnpike expansion instead of that plan, and the MPO originally voted that down and stated that it was, it was a overly destructive way of fixing the congestion. But the authority, the Turnpike Authority, then took control of the whole planning process and let us study, starting in 2011 that it concluded, of course, that the only viable alternative was a new Turnpike. And, yeah, of course. And since that time,
Tiffany Owens Reed 14:57
study all your red flagship. Threat going off. I've
Stanis Moody Roberts 15:01
learned that quite a bit through this process.
Tiffany Owens Reed 15:07
Sorry. I interrupted you a little bit there, if you want to, if there was something else you wanted to add to that. So they take over. They get this study. They say, obviously, the only way to solve this problem is to expand the turnpike. Go ahead from
Stanis Moody Roberts 15:19
there. Yeah. And since that time, the MPO has been sidelined. They have not been involved in this area. They've just, they haven't taken a formal stand or anything. They've just said the Turnpike Authority has been given control of planning for this area, and so they're they're, they're the ones that are doing this. And it's just a classic case of project that at one time may have been justifiable, back in those early 2000 years, when the traffic was seen as being exponentially increasing and you had to do something major to to solve for the next 50 years in the future, but now it's just reliant on its own momentum, given the current data.
Tiffany Owens Reed 16:12
Yeah, why I feel like this is one of those questions that can be something you stay up late at night, thinking about, but what do you think was sort of just from what you know about MTA, that main Turnpike Authority? What do you think was going on here with kind of pushing for this, you know, all or nothing, this, this, what Jane Jacobs would call, like a cataclysmic change style solution to this congestion problem. Like, why do you think that there was just like so little appetite for a more incremental solution? Like, Oh, this bypass road, maybe we should try that first, the
Stanis Moody Roberts 16:54
structure of the MTA of the the Turnpike Authority. They are really a very bureaucratic organization that doesn't know have a reason to want to streamline costs. They can just raise tolls to pay for for any additional spending. But they have a especially, I think the the executive director that has been in charge for the past several years has really wanted to have a legacy project, both for themselves, personally, to have done something major to the state and to Get that recognition, and also in order really to necessitate the continuance of the Turnpike Authority, it's a very outdated, obsolete organization that originally was there to fund something that the state couldn't fund itself through bonding, and it's a complete duplication of the regular State department of transportation when it comes to maintaining the road. So the way that they can kind of pursue and ensure their continued existence is to have major infrastructure project that they are the only ones that can, they can possibly do so that, I think, is what has led to this steadfast pursuit, despite the changing data of expanding here.
Tiffany Owens Reed 18:36
So one of their narratives was that this was going to have a positive effect on the local economy. Can you? Can you? Can you flesh that out a little bit. How are they able to make this claim?
Stanis Moody Roberts 18:47
It's a claim that they keep stating for all of their projects, that how important they are to contribute so many, so much money into the local construction in the local economy, through through their infrastructure projects, and that influx of funds into the economy is one part. But they also claim that the turnpike extension will bring economic opportunity to Gorham and to the surrounding communities by connecting them to the rest of the of the highway system, and that somehow that's going to trans translate into all these manufacturing companies or other companies wanting to move in and set up shop there. That is, is something that might seem like it could make sense in theory, but it's more likely, when you have a highway expansion like this, that you're bringing in Walmarts, that you're bringing in strip malls that are actually destructive to the. Local small businesses in the area. So it's it's definitely a narrative that has is not as truthful as it might seem.
Tiffany Owens Reed 20:10
Okay, alright, so speaking of local businesses, let's introduce another character to the story, the family and the business at smiling Hill Farm. Can you tell us why this farm is special to the community?
Stanis Moody Roberts 20:26
Yes, so smiling Hill Farm is the real hero this story, and probably the only reason we've had the success that we've had, or one of the major reasons, but they are a beloved institution in Southern Maine smiling Hill Farm is a historical landmark. It's been an operation of the same family for over 300 years.
Tiffany Owens Reed 20:53
Incredible
Stanis Moody Roberts 20:55
1700s that's incredible, or early 1700s I think they had their 300th anniversary. So one of the oldest continuously operated businesses in the entire country, and it's so much more than a dairy farm, they really, in order to ensure their survival, starting 1970s opened the farm up and diversified so that they now have a retail local milk operation where they sell glass bottles of all their milk through various supermarkets and local stores around Maine. They have an ice cream business and a cheese business, where they also sell, sell those products, not just at their location, but in various retail places around the state, and it's open to the public, so you can go and visit. You can have birthday parties there, field trips there from neighboring schools and learn how to milk a cow and get to know the other livestock at the farm. And it's it's just a place that generations of Mainers now have gone to and visited as little kids and really fallen in love with our agricultural heritage through there, through that farm.
Tiffany Owens Reed 22:26
So let's bring the stories together here. So tell us about how the expansion would have affected this, this wonderful farm, this, this place that means so much to Mainers. So
Stanis Moody Roberts 22:38
it's, it's a really picturesque farm. It's a very, very old, large red barn right on the road and extensive hay fields that are just gorgeous expanse as you're coming down Route 22 and then they have their ice cream parlor and their another barn and operation up on this hill that is its namesake, the smiling Hill. The highway itself would be cutting right through the western side of the farm. And not only would it be cutting through the farm, but it would also be placing an interchange right on that location. So far more extensive than just a highway cutting through you now have arms of interchange sprawling around, and I actually live right across the street from it, so that interchange would also be right on top of my driveway, but it would be taking about five acres of their hay field, which, of course, is invaluable to provide the hay for their cows. This is not a factory farm. That's a farm where their cows, throughout the the summer and good weather are outside grazing, and it would have far more impact than just taking their property. The highway, with its resulting pollution and environmental damage, would affect affect the farm, in that regard, to further than just its footprint, and the noise would also have have a very bad effect, and all that together makes it so that the farm has been firm and that they can't imagine continuing to exist should This highway go through. And a reminder is that it's a labor of love for them. It's not the the value of their land is far more in terms of its monetary value than farming it gives them so they do it because they. Love what they do, and they they love giving back to the community in that way. And the Turnpike Authority has been adamant that they're going to be, you know, compensated justly, for the land that the turnpike will be taking, and that the Turnpike is only taking the western portion of the farm, and it's not going to have any profound impact on their operations. So fighting that narrative has been important.
Tiffany Owens Reed 25:30
Okay, so speaking of fighting this, this narrative, this expansion, it sounds to me like it was really when people understood how this would affect this farm, that some momentum got going to oppose this expansion. So people start rallying together on the farm, pushing back on the expansion. And that's where our next character come in, comes in, which is yourself. So tell us a little bit about your story and motivation and kind of what. Yeah, like, how did you become involved in this and what did that involvement look like for you.
Stanis Moody Roberts 26:03
So when it was announced, it really felt like it was a done deal, that there wasn't much that we could do, that this had been planned out and decided long before, and that the public process that they by law do have to go through, including their permitting process was just going to be this sort of act, and the conclusion of its The turnpike's construction was, was already preordained. And it, it, yeah, there. It didn't seem like there was much hope. But starting with the farm, they decided to have a media event where they would invite the media and bring a rally of people together and just state that they were opposed and that this would be so destructive to to the farm and to the neighboring community as well. And I went to that rally and started talking to people that were there, and it that, I think, was the starting point to feeling like this is worth fighting, this is worth dedicating, you know, time that is precious and that we would at least go down fighting and not Just accept this for for being a done deal.
Tiffany Owens Reed 27:41
Okay, so tell me, as you kind of came to this, this decision point of, like, realizing that it was worth it to get involved, worth it to try to push back on this. How did you sort of, how did you, I feel like that can look so many different ways for different people, what it what did you kind of settle on in terms of the best way forward for like yourself, in terms of participating in this and then bringing other people along with that.
Stanis Moody Roberts 28:11
So first, we really had no idea what approach to take. There was a group that formed of like minded people for various reasons that that opposed the turnpike plans, including people like me that were directly impacted, people that were coming from environmental concern, people that were coming from just concern of of government abuse and the domain and what it would do to the character of the surrounding area, you know, continuing to to increase sprawl in those more rural parts of Maine, and increasingly turning those more rural areas into suburban, sprawling communities, and for me, I took more of a local role. I started talking with neighbors, and we figured out that the best thing we could do is just start petitioning our town and our town had supported a few years before the idea of the Turnpike, in theory, four surrounding towns had all been recruited by the Turnpike Authority to sign a memorandum of understanding that basically said that the towns were on board with the turnpike's plans, and thought that it was It would be ideal for the towns to have this solution. So our goal was to just go to the towns and. Explain, and particularly for me, to go to my town, Scarborough, and with our neighbors, and explain why we thought this was such a bad idea and why it was so destructive to us in our section of town, and that's where it all began.
Tiffany Owens Reed 30:20
Okay? So I would like you to kind of flesh out a little bit more this strategy of focusing on convincing your town councils. I think this might be a little bit unique to your city and state, so you all kind of focus your efforts on convincing the members of this council to oppose the expansion. Can you? Can you? Can you just explain a little bit about why you chose to focus on that? There
Stanis Moody Roberts 30:44
are a couple of things that were sort of intersecting that meant that town support was vital for the for the turnpike to to go forward with this project. The first is permitting the turnpike had very little argument in the permitting processes for why this was the least environmentally destructive alternative, which is required in order to get an environmental permit, you have to prove that there's no less environmentally impacting way of achieving your your goal, and the stated goal was to improve mobility and safety within this transportation corridor, and because so little has been done to try To do your initial steps, like improving your intersections, Spot widening, as we talked about before, the way that the turnpike was trying to sell this to the permitting authorities was that the localities, The municipalities and the communities were so against any other means of improving mobility, so expanding widening or expanding intersections, that that meant that all of those were off the table, even though they'd have much less environmental impact, and that this turnpike was was the only way that the community's force could foresee the the issue being fixed. So that's a long explanation, but um, that meant that their permitting, their means of getting a environmental permitting, was contingent on on strong town support. And then also we have in Maine something called this main sensible Transportation Act, which was passed by voter referendum back in 1991 in order to prevent the Turnpike, at the time from widening the turnpike to an additional lane for its its whole extent, and the referendum mandated that by law that any transportation decision involving widening or involving a new road has to go through a extensive process, that it needs local support, that it needs to have a public process in which local input is both received and followed, and that it all viable alternatives must be tried before any increase in road capacity is implemented, and so that that referendum and that law also means that the state really that the Turnpike Authority really required a local support in order to move forward. So that all goes to say that that being able to make our case at the local level was would be powerful enough to stop this project.
Tiffany Owens Reed 34:11
Okay, that's really helpful. Thank you for walking us through that. So I would like it if you could just share with us maybe some like of your favorite memories, or just, I think people listening to this might be like, Wow, fighting a highway expansion, meeting with your council, but maybe it's hard to know, like, what does that exactly look like on a day to day, street level, kind of fashion or level? I don't know which word I was going for there. So can you just share with us maybe, what were some of the strategic actions you took to kind of cultivate that conversation, to grow awareness, to grow participation from other from other residents, and to really, you know, capture the attention of the council in such a way as to as to make your case. So
Stanis Moody Roberts 34:55
we're lucky here in sky bro, where I. We're a small town that's that's grown quite a lot recently, but still has kind of a neighborly small town community, and we have an amazing town council. The very first thing that I did was go to a town council meeting, and I'd never done anything like that before, and I was very distraught, and just assumed that I was, you know, going up against these monsters that were supporting this Turnpike. And immediately after, I spoke against it and how it impact me and smiling Hill and my neighbors, the chair of the of the council first just said, No, we are your neighbors. We're so glad that you've come to us. We don't want to see any of this, of anyone hurt in this town. And immediately wanted to kind of fresh out this issue, and not just, you know, cast it aside, and our town management too, who had been supportive of the turnpike plans also, instead of maybe trying to block us or try to to keep us down. Um, also wanted to encouraged us to, you know, make our case and make our voices heard. Um, so one of the first things that I did was get our our neighborhood together. I went door to door and talked to talk to a lot of my neighbors, and we had a meeting of the kind of the core neighbors that were were involved and against it, and we just started encouraging our other people In the town to write emails to the to the town council and to speak at town council meetings and really convey that if they, if they were of the opinion that this was a bad idea and one of the most important things, smiling Hill Farm and contingent of people that really loved the farm put together a Facebook group called Protect smiling Hill Farm. And that group just took off and grew from 100 people to 1000 people to 5000 people. And I think as of now, it's over 5000 people on Facebook group, and we just started networking on that Facebook group and sharing stories and really starting to dive into data, which for me became the most important thing that I could do, which was really look into traffic data and convey why there was a better way of addressing congestion, and that the turnpike was a very overbuilt and destructive manner of doing so. And that was also that the feedback that I first got from the town council was what put together a really cohesive and comprehensive argument about why this is the wrong idea and why there's a better way of doing it. And we put a lot of effort into that. And within a couple months, the town council was was really questioning the whole idea of the turnpike expansion and ready to ready to vote against it. What we ran into, though, is the Turnpike Authority was determined not to let that happen, because, as I explained before, it would be very difficult for them to move forward if the town were to make an official proclamation against the turnpike plans and take away their former support. So various various things happen over the next few months, with the turnpike trying to delay that, the turnpike had promised to have a public input session in the town, and the town council had originally said, let's wait for the public input session in order to have a vote. And that public input session was first going to be in May, and then it was pushed back to June, and then was pushed back to July, and then in July, the executive director of the Turnpike Authority stepped down, which was, we think, likely, because of how much of a fiasco this whole project was turning into for them and the turnip. Authority then said that they would have to wait for the next public input session until a new executive director was hired, in which case we then started pushing for the town council to just take a formal vote. Okay,
Tiffany Owens Reed 40:17
very dramatic, but it sounds like y'all really found a strategy that was effective in terms of really focusing on cultivating conversation with the council, mobilizing local residents, helping them show up and give comment, and really having your data organized to make, make your clear Make, make a clear case. One thing I'm curious about is what I'm just curious, what has it been like communicating about this issue, I feel like highway expansions, anything related to driving, highways, traffic and parking, can always be a little bit contentious in places where, like, people drive a lot. And I feel like kind of maybe like our default, I think so much especially about highway expansions, is like there is an element of it where it seems to just make sense on a surface level. You really have to kind of push past those initial reactions to help people see, you know, like, what the problems are with taking that approach to solving congestion issues. So I'm just curious, what has it been like having conversations with your local neighbors, especially in a place like Maine, where I feel like there can be somewhat of like a urban rural divide. I suspect if you're living out in the rural area, like you are driving a lot, I'm just I don't I was, I've never been to like this. I've been to Portland, but I haven't been I haven't spent any time in the rural area. So I'm just curious, what has that been like, kind of facilitating that conversation and helping people, yeah, like, coalesce and come together around a narrative for their community and a narrative for what transportation should look like in their community.
Stanis Moody Roberts 41:46
You're exactly right. The Turnpike Authority had gone a head start on us, and had really been driving home how infrastructure expansion is always a good thing that this was going to be completely paid for by tolls, so it wasn't going to increase taxes, and that it was, like we mentioned before, this economic imperative to bring the highway to surrounding towns. And a lot of people, I think, were bought into that argument, that that it's only a good thing if the term picked authority is going to do this, that infrastructure is a good thing, that economic development is a good thing, and that being a more kind of rural area, there wasn't any practical way of solving things with public transportation, for example. So that narrative, I think, would have been continuing to be probably majority of people and particularly compelling if it weren't for smiling Hill Farm, first of all, and other residents that would be losing their homes, and this area is, like you said, historically rural, growing quickly, but still has that kind of small town feel, where everyone is connected at least by one degree of separation, so everyone kind of knows everyone, or at least knows of everyone. And the the belovedness of smiling Hill Farm really drove home the direct impact that the turnpike would have and the other the other people that would be losing their homes as well, was is particularly compelling in a more rural area where where everyone is connected in that way. One concern that I had particularly was for it not to become a partisan issue. And I think there's a possibility sometimes of that happening, particularly where an argument against highway expansion might be public transportation, and that can sort of become partisan around the practicalities of that. But initially, the strongest contingent that really rallied around smiling Hill Farm in particular was the sort of more conservative population that was up in arms against government abuse and eminent domain. Was such a beloved agricultural landmark, and there also were a lot of concerns around how this highway would fundamentally alter the surrounding towns and change the smaller town community. That people really loved, and turned it into just another generic suburb. So, so there was that, there was a lot of environmental concern directed at the destructiveness that the Turnpike, the new Turnpike, would cause, and then again, from a kind of broader perspective around climate change and how we grow, that we really need to stop putting so much funding into highway expansion and change that direction and invest in more sustainable ways of growing. All
Tiffany Owens Reed 45:41
right, staunis, you've done an amazing job walking us through this story, and I'd love it if you could just give us an update as to like where things are now. So it's been about a year. I know you mentioned there have been some delays that you're hoping that, did the council, did the council formally pass that vote and make a decision there? And maybe you can just tell us some other things that have happened where things are now? Are
Stanis Moody Roberts 46:04
Now, yes, so it took a lot longer than we initially thought, because of all the attempts at delaying that the Turnpike Authority was was really trying hard, but our Scarborough Town Council finally voted in October, six to one to rescind the town support for the the turnpike project. And that was a result of two back to back meetings, of of of mobilizing and bringing 200 plus people to the town meetings over capacity, where people had to be turned, turned away from the doors of the of the town, town chambers, And a really sort of joyous occasion where everyone, I think, was really, really excited about that, that concluding vote, and it immediately put a damper and really sucked the wind Out of the turnpike's efforts. Officially, right now, the project is delayed. They took it off their five year work or four year work plan. It was originally slated to start construction by the end of this year. In their initial proposal, they took it off their work plan so it's not on. Not planned to start before 2020 29 but the feeling for sure is that it's all but dead, that it's what is referred to as a zombie project, where the authority isn't really capable of acknowledging that it's dead yet, but it's it's off the table right now, and it doesn't seem like there's any way that it could possibly come back with that. With the contingent being that it does require a majority of the public to support it, and that is clearly not the case right now. So so yeah, we are in somewhat of a holding pattern right now, but the momentum is definitely on our side, and it's hard to envision them moving forward at this point, but we're still trying to make sure they legally can't move forward, and that requires legislative action. So our wonderful state senator for this, for both Gorham and Scarborough, actually has sponsored legislation for the upcoming legislative session. She's sponsored three different bills. One bill is specific to this turnpike proposal that would remove the turnpike authority's ability to to construct the the turnpike sprayer. One proposal would require that the Turnpike Authority contribute in other ways to the state, so that they don't have the huge surplus that they have right now, that they're just looking to spend and the third one, which is most hopeful is to to permanently disband the main Turnpike Authority and to to roll it into the Main Department of Transportation, to roll it back into the state. Government, which is similar to how other states operate their turnpikes, including our next door neighbor, New Hampshire, who has always had their turnpike system integrated into their state government, into their State department of transportation. And although New Hampshire has their turnpike system actually has pretty much exactly the same lane miles as the main turnpike system. They operate with almost half the budget of the main Turnpike Authority, and they have half the amount of debt as the Turnpike Authority, and they have twice the net position, which is the net amount of assets over their liabilities as the main Turnpike Authority. So a much more efficient and streamlined organization in a way that the state could, if they were to copy that to really, could save on overall transportation costs and make a dent in our in our transportation budget. So that's the effort that we're looking towards for this upcoming spring.
Tiffany Owens Reed 51:21
All right, those are really exciting. Um, I, I, I'm gonna ask you a question that I didn't put in in our formal list. But I'm just curious, saunas, what are you hoping for? Transportation in general, like in your city, like now that you all have been, for all intents and purposes, successful at preventing this highway expansion. I'm just curious. Like, when you think about transportation solutions, you know, I'm not sure what you would say with, like, if you said, if you were to say, here's what I think the priority should be. You know, as we're looking to, like, where our communities are, what they need, and looking towards the future. But I'm just curious, is there anything you like, hope like this? All this momentum can be, can be steered towards in terms of, like, a positive vision for transportation, innovation and just improvement in your area. Yeah.
Stanis Moody Roberts 52:07
So specific to Maine, we it's impossible to you know forecast what the future is going to look like, but demographically, our our deaths have far exceeded our births in Maine for quite some time, and the only reason the population has been somewhat growing has been in migration into the state. But the official you know, state demographic forecasts for Greater Portland are that within five years, our population will peak and will start to decline, and that is all the more reason that we should not be expanding our pavement, expanding our Roads, expanding our our transportation, pavement infrastructure, because those costs associated are going to be increasingly difficult for a state to pay for with an older and older population and shrinking population. So from a fiscally sustainably perspective, it's a really, really bad idea. But then environmentally, culturally, it's also a terrible idea, because every you know paved acre is an acre that is unable to do what it is supposed to do in terms of our ecosystem on terms of being able to absorb rain and purify water and provide habitat to our wildlife. And this turnpike would do so much more than just pave over the its footprint. It would create increasing sprawl that would further pave over and develop the surrounding area. And we need to grow in a way that's sustainable, and the sustainable way to grow is to grow in the areas that we already have developed. So to really double down and concentrate on denser, more compact growth and preserving our open spaces, and preserving our our farmland. And this whole fight against the main Turnpike Authority and against the this turnpike spur has really been about that overall picture, particularly emblematic in smiling Hill Farm and its fight for survival against the highway.
Tiffany Owens Reed 54:56
All right. In closing, sonus, can you tell us a little bit about your city? Me, do you consider yourself living in Portland? But not? I'm taking you told me you have lands. I'm not. I'm considered. I'm betting that you don't consider yourself living in Portland proper, but you can pick, pick any town, any city. Tell us a little bit about it, and then if there are public, local spots that you like to recommend people visit, we'd love to hear about those too. Yeah,
Stanis Moody Roberts 55:21
so it's the Greater Portland area, and I've lived here all my life. I now live like I said, in Scarborough. I've lived here for about seven years now, built my house here and and just really, really love this area so much. Maine is such a beautiful place. We have a our major industry is tourism, and that's for good reason. We have a beautiful, beautiful coastline. We have an interior that is so picturesque with rolling farmland and deep woods and mountains. So Maine is Maine has Maine really has it all. Portland in particular, in the past 20 or 30 years has really gone from kind of a more gritty, rundown city to a destination with an amazing food scene and just a beautiful old we call it the old port, a downtown city, downtown that feels like it's much more of a downtown than many other cities that are three or four times its size, but it's cobblestone streets, it's alleyways, it's wonderful little local stores and restaurants. So come visit Maine for sure, but try to take the back roads and try to avoid the main turnpike if you can, going up along the coast. Is a much longer way of visiting Portland, but much more scenic way, and you don't have to pay the tolls to a authority that's trying to take away our farms and pave over our houses.
Tiffany Owens Reed 57:21
Do you have, like, a favorite, like coffee shop or favorite, like neighborhood pub or restaurant or anything like that, that you like to take friends and they come to town?
Stanis Moody Roberts 57:30
Oh, um, there are some really eclectic places here. I'm moving on now and into my 30s and having a baby in a month and a half. But one of the places I always like to bring friends when they visited was Bubba's sulky Lounge, which is this, this very eclectic bar and dance hall in Portland. It's straight out of it's a it's straight out of the 70s and 80s, and it's a mix of of dive bar, of really, like typical main world sort of dive bar and and sort of retro dance hall With light up dance floors and mannequins everywhere. And really, really retro artifacts all over the walls, and it always feels like in the middle of a wedding. It's just unlike other clubs that you might go to that have, you know, a certain demographic. This is really everyone that is there from 21 year old celebrating their first drink, to 65 year old celebrating their 40th anniversary. So it's a great place to go out and to dance and just kind of see some of the old, older, main culture that I think still exists there. Alright,
Tiffany Owens Reed 59:02
I'm gonna ask you one more thing, but may I I've been to Portland, I know it's a bit of a foodie town. So what's your favorite place to grab a bite that just give us like what you think as like a local is a good place to check out, because I feel like there's just so many options. It's hard to know.
Stanis Moody Roberts 59:19
It is. It's really difficult, and it depends on what you're definitely on what you're looking for. But I guess I Yeah, it's, it's difficult for me to recommend one place in particular, but I think our seafood is is quite unique. You have some really great seafood places that are serving local fresh seafood from the docks. So Commercial Street is a great place to great stocking place there that's right on the waterfront. But I also have to plug my partner. We're. Works at Mr. Tuna, which is a fairly new restaurant that serves sushi that just won a couple of really prestigious awards, and they serve only local, local seafood that's right from the docks, and a great place to to enjoy Maine's main seafood right in Portland sold port
Tiffany Owens Reed 1:00:22
amazing. Thank you so much. Sona, it's been great having you on the show. Thank you for coming on to share your story and hopefully to inspire our listeners who maybe were feeling a little bit like you were feeling at the start with as they look at their communities and the challenges that their community is facing, and thinking, Oh, this is probably just too big to take on. I know I can definitely relate to that. So it's been really inspiring to hear how you jumped in anyway and looks like, I think we could say you've been, if not, successful, like, definitely on the more successful side of things, with preventing what what would have been a very destructive highway expansion in your town. So I'm really glad we got to capture that story for our listeners. And yeah, I wish you the best as you continue to see how the story unfolds.
Stanis Moody Roberts 1:01:15
Thank you so much, Tiffany. And just to echo what you said, I think this is a really good example of of how you can absolutely change things, and the powers that be will try to convince you that there's nothing you can do, that everything's been decided, that you don't matter. And start locally. Start with your neighbors, start with your your local community, and remember that you're, we live in a democracy, and especially on the local level, it's it's your your community and your neighbors that are serving in those elected positions at the at the municipal level, and they will be the best means for you to make your voice heard and never trust the data that's put out by an organization that is actively trying to pursue a certain goal, because that's what really, I Think, unleashed things for us is realizing that the data that they were in, the arguments that the Turnpike Authority had, were completely wrong and just made up, and that using the data ourselves that was really, actually real, helped to quickly change the
Tiffany Owens Reed 1:02:39
narrative. Never, never trust the study. Yes, yes, exactly.
Stanis Moody Roberts 1:02:45
So much Stephanie, and definitely encourage anyone out there that's in the same fight to not to not to give up. Excellent.
Tiffany Owens Reed 1:02:53
Those are great, great words to end on if you're listening to this. Thank you so much for joining us for another conversation. We'll be back next week with another another episode. If there's someone in your community who you think you should have on the show, please let us know using the suggested guest form in our show notes. Until then, keep doing what you can to build a strong town.
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Tiffany Owens Reed is the host of The Bottom-Up Revolution podcast. A graduate of The King's College and former journalist, she is a New Yorker at heart, currently living in Texas. In addition to writing for Strong Towns and freelancing as a project manager, she reads, writes, and curates content for Cities Decoded, an educational platform designed to help ordinary people understand cities. Explore free resources here and follow her on Instagram @citiesdecoded.